I, Tonya
I, Tonya
#1I, Tonya
Posted: 1/11/18 at 7:26pm
Who saw it and what do we think? I thought it was the best film I saw last year. Truly moving and harrowing to say the least. The truth is I really do think she was handed a real **** deck of cards and her life, scandal or not, was always gonna be an uphill battle. It really reminded me of Aileen Wuronos in Monster in that way.
I also think that she was a superior athlete to Nancy and that shouldn’t go unrecognized which is the real tragedy is she never really needed to take Nancy out to win. She could’ve done it on her own. She was a physically superior athlete. She was the only US woman to do a ****ing triple axel. I mean in what other sport does presentation and what your uniform looks like and what music is played make a difference in your scores? None. I have so much respect for Tonya for being an anti conformist. She had a resilient spirit, and was a survivor, and overcame every odd against her. She’s very flawed. But when you have the life that she had, who wouldn’t be?
**SPOILERS AHEAD**
My other thought in terms of her involvement vs. not is that she agreed them to giving Nancy a threat but I’m positive she didn’t have anymore involvement. And I don’t even think it was her idea to attack. I think she got the practice times to figure out how to get access to her to deliver a death threat but I think Shawn Eckhardt and Steve Gahooley were behind it completely in terms of attacking her esp. Eckhardt. Tonya def knew that an attack would’ve been taking it too far but once she said yes to helping with the death threat she got herself in too deep plus Jeff held her at gunpoint and said that he’d literally kill her if she told and that was really hard to watch personally bc it reminded me of how my abuser told me if I told that he’d ruin me when I was a kid and like that psychological abuse is really intense. Also I don’t even think she would’ve considered giving her a death threat if Shawn Eckhardt hadn’t planted a death threat against her so really I blame him for the whole thing. Also Allison Janey slayed and I have 0 doubt that her mom wasn’t completely like that bc the truth is always stranger than fiction and from multiple accounts Lavona was really cruel and unhinged.
**SPOILERS END**
#4I, Tonya
Posted: 1/11/18 at 10:46pm
Watched it last night. Thought it showed her as a victim which I don't believe she was, complicit, yes. The portrayal of her Mom border lined a Kabuki style villainess. Even Disney would not sink that low. I for one was not impressed and refuse to feel sorry for her.
Those Blocked: SueStorm. N2N Nate. Good riddence to stupid! Rad-Z, shill begone!
dramamama611
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/4/07
#5I, Tonya
Posted: 1/12/18 at 1:21pm
Tonya seems to think Janney totally NAILED the portrayal of her mum. (I caught part of an interview.)
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These are DISCUSSION boards, not mutual admiration boards. Discussion only occurs when we are willing to hear what others are thinking, regardless of whether it is alignment to our own thoughts.
#6I, Tonya
Posted: 1/12/18 at 2:59pm
PBS just aired a documentary on Tonya et al last night (Thursday 1-11). Fascinating to see the real people all over again after being so inculcated with the images of Margot Robbie, Allison Janey, etc. I've been contending all along that despite Ms Robbie's obvious skill, there was no way that stunning statuesque actress could match what I remembered of the tough awkward little bird that was the real Tonya Harding in the flesh.
And there was actually some good news at the end of the documentary if you think of Tonya Harding (as I do) as chiefly a victim of some absolutely detestable men in her life. She says that at 47, she's actually come through to a happier place in her life, with a husband she loves of 7 years and a son she adores. Attagirl.
#7I, Tonya
Posted: 1/16/18 at 12:08am
As someone who wasn’t alive during the incident, I’ve only ever heard about and have never seen any images really. I actually thought Tonya herself beat of Nancy and that Nancy couldn’t compete for however long and that it was on the day of the Olympic Games. This movie taught me a lot!!!! In the end the film made me sympathize for Tonya and the way she was treated by comedians, her loved ones, that judge, the PEOPLE. She was blamed for something she barely had anything to do with and that court room scene was just hard to look at. I’m happy to hear Tonya is now in a good place, but I just can’t imagine what it was like to learn you couldn’t do something that was your LIFE ever again.
Oh and that fat friend!! My god what an idiot!
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Liza's Headband
Broadway Legend Joined: 5/28/13
#10I, Tonya
Posted: 1/28/18 at 1:23pm
Thanks, Mister Matt, for saying it so I didn't have to.
The fact that younger ones in this country are "learning" about the incident through a fictional (yes, FICTIONAL) movie is beyond alarming.
Start with the fabulous 2014 documentary, "The Price of Gold," and then let's talk. Far more balanced, fair, and informative. This was an attempt to bring forth Tony's redemption tale, which is total BS. The movie admits as much in the beginning title card.
Jorge -- try learning more from reality than fiction next time.
GeorgeandDot
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/13/16
#12I, Tonya
Posted: 1/28/18 at 8:19pm
GeorgeandDot said: "Has there been any actual proof that Tonya Harding had anything to do with the attack or are we still blaming abused women for the supid actions of their husbands?"
There has been no smoking gun, if that’s what you’re asking. Plenty of speculation and things that certainly point that way (for example, her having the practice times), but nothing that would ever hold up in court.
#13I, Tonya
Posted: 1/28/18 at 8:56pm
^but didn’t they hold up in court? Or was that ban from figure skating not a court?
In our millions, in our billions, we are most powerful when we stand together. TW4C unwaveringly joins the worldwide masses, for we know our liberation is inseparably bound.
Signed,
Theater Workers for a Ceasefire
https://theaterworkersforaceasefire.com/statement
Updated On: 1/29/18 at 08:56 PM
#14I, Tonya
Posted: 1/28/18 at 9:24pm
Call_me_jorge said: "^but didn’t they hold up in court? Or was that ban from fugue skating not a court?"
She pleaded guilty to hindering the prosecution, but never admitted to having any direct role in the attack. She accepted a lifetime ban from the US Figure Skating Association, who conducted their own investigation and determined she knew of the attack (but that obviously isn't a court of law).
ScottyDoesn'tKnow2
Broadway Legend Joined: 1/22/14
#16I, Tonya
Posted: 1/29/18 at 4:57pm
I find it troubling that some here took the incredible revision of history as fact. I think one can feel for Tonya, understand her troubled upbringing and abuse, and the way the media portrayed her as unjust but still research some facts about the case and her history in figure skating to understand that the events in the movie were fictional and that the filmmakers were busy portraying Tonya as nothing but a victim who always skated well and never won anything or received any support.
Fact is, every skater has a few competitions where they feel they were underscored or should have placed higher. If they were all right then we'd have multiple gold medalists. Tonya received a lot of help, but understandably, as a victim of abuse and neglect and a product of a very dysfunctional marriage, was not in a position to best receive it. I also don't believe she was ever short changed in competition in that all of her results were fair. There may have been one or two where one could argue she could have placed higher, but then there would exist a counter-argument to that. If anything, this movie did a disservice to the "nameless" competitors Tonya competed against by portraying them as personality-less figures. There was also some whitewashing going on as well but it would not fit this film's agenda of only Tonya being put upon by the system.
And there was evidence that could have held up in court against Tonya, but after the media circus, the prosecutor's office offered her a plea deal which Tonya readily accepted knowing full well what it included. She was NEVER blindsided about the lifetime ban, and the court never issued a lifetime ban. The United States Figure Skating Association, a private organization, made its own determination on that after receiving the evidence the FBI produced. You know who else received that evidence to review? Nancy Kerrigan, and she's convinced Tonya was in on it.
Here is a Detroit Free Press timeline of events:
https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/detroit/2017/12/07/nancy-kerrigan-tonya-harding-timeline/866861001/
I believe a big part of the ban was that Tonya took a portion of the money the United Skates Figure Skating Association gave her to fund her training and travel to help fund the attack on Nancy Kerrigan.
The film's portrayal that Shawn Eckhardt acted unilaterally and planned the attack himself contradicts everything that anybody knew about this case prior, including journalists and law enforcement who did their own research and gathered their own evidence. Same thing about how Shawn sent the death threat without Tonya and Jeff's knowledge. Many at the time felt Tonya called it in to avoid having to compete at a lower-level qualifying event and instead receive a bye to Nationals. Some joked that Tonya did it to set the stage for the attack to make it look like a crazy person is out there attacking figure skaters, but of course jokes are not evidence. However, that was the thinking at the time. I think this new tale came about because Eckhardt is dead and can't defend himself so Tonya and/or Jeff felt safe to come up with that version of the story to take the fire off of themselves, that is until Tonya in that ABC interview two weeks ago admitted to knowing things about what they were planning BEFORE the attack happened. Tonya has been telling inconsistent stories for the past 24 years and she changes it every time she thinks a retelling would benefit her image and that people will not remember that it contradicts the things she's said in the past. She may have been right with the way some are accepting this movie as total fact.
The film wanted to rehabilitate Tonya and make us look at our own prejudiced attitudes towards those who are described as being from a certain class, but in the end, it ended up mocking EVERYBODY other than Tonya and played them as jokes to be laughed at.
#17I, Tonya
Posted: 1/29/18 at 8:40pm
Delete
In our millions, in our billions, we are most powerful when we stand together. TW4C unwaveringly joins the worldwide masses, for we know our liberation is inseparably bound.
Signed,
Theater Workers for a Ceasefire
https://theaterworkersforaceasefire.com/statement
Updated On: 1/29/18 at 08:40 PM
#18I, Tonya
Posted: 2/4/18 at 11:36am
The film wanted to rehabilitate Tonya and make us look at our own prejudiced attitudes towards those who are described as being from a certain class, but in the end, it ended up mocking EVERYBODY other than Tonya and played them as jokes to be laughed at.
Oh, it mocked Tonya, too. Just to a lesser degree.
"What can you expect from a bunch of seitan worshippers?" - Reginald Tresilian
bear88
Broadway Legend Joined: 4/26/16
#20I, Tonya
Posted: 3/26/18 at 3:25am
I finally caught the movie yesterday.
Allison Janney may have done a perfect version of Tonya Harding's mother, but I didn't think the part was all that difficult. I was surprised that Laurie Metcalf didn't win, even though I had problems with Lady Bird overall, because her performance has stuck with me months later.
I don't remember all the facts, but the film seemed to let Harding off pretty easy. That scene at the end where Robbie looks directly at the camera and, as Harding, blames the audience for treating her as a joke is hard to take seriously.
I followed figure skating back in those days, and I remember rooting for Harding because she was an exciting skater with impressive athletic ability who was frustrating to watch because she pretty consistently screwed up at big moments. It culminated in the fiasco at the 1994 Olympics. That ridiculous, fictitious speech to the judge annoyed me, because everyone knew that Harding was done - even if she hadn't played a role in the Kerrigan attack.
Margot Robbie does the best she can, but she seems miscast as Harding.
If the movie maintained its wiseacre tone throughout, basically throwing up its ends about the facts, maybe I would have enjoyed it more. When it took sides, I tended to recoil.
#21I, Tonya
Posted: 3/26/18 at 8:58am
I, Tonya is to Harding as Hamilton (the musical) is to Hamilton, Burr, et. al. That is, it's a simplified, entertaining piece of fiction that the average human mistakes for a history lesson. Because our species generally only likes to learn easily and via entertainment.
dramamama611
Broadway Legend Joined: 12/4/07
#22I, Tonya
Posted: 3/26/18 at 11:12am
Additionally, isn't it from her point of view? (I'm assuming from what I've heard, and the title.)
If we're not having fun, then why are we doing it?
These are DISCUSSION boards, not mutual admiration boards. Discussion only occurs when we are willing to hear what others are thinking, regardless of whether it is alignment to our own thoughts.
#24I, Tonya
Posted: 3/26/18 at 12:14pm
I greatly enjoyed the movie for what it was, but wished it decided earlier what it was going to be. The he-said, she-said mockumentary of the first half largely disappears in favor of making a really good Coens-style crime comedy in the second half. If the film had picked an approach and committed entirely, it would have been great, instead of just pretty good with a handful of outstanding performances.
#25I, Tonya
Posted: 4/20/18 at 12:51am
Some of you guys are such uppity pricks. For context I'm close to 30, and Tonya's goings on happened when I was very young so I don't think it's "alarming" that people are finding out about it now, especially young people such as myself. "Alarming" is entirely overdramatic, and condescending as hell. Sorry we couldn't all keep up with stories from when we were first born. I was barely through grade school when the Monika Lewinsky scandal happened, and I knew about that. I'm sure you weren't aware of every high-profile news story when you were under -10 that happened either, sh*theads. Also no one DIED in this story, it wasn't a murder spree.
I also avidly disagree with the Hamilton comparison, Hamilton is literally ancient history. Everything in that movie is done with interviews from Tonya herself. I'm pretty sure that's as close to do with the truth that truth gets. Everyone involved besides Shawn is still alive.
Also if you don't think for a god damn second that Tonya wasn't treated unfairly, you have no idea what it's like to be abused and an outcast, especially in a world as superficial as WOMEN'S FIGURESKATING. Women's Figureskating in terms of its presentation is a step above modeling. Looks and playing the game are everything.
Honestly, I don't care what anyone says: Tonya Harding kicks ass and conquered the odds. She was in abusive relationship that bit her in the ass that she was in to escape her abusive mother. Try being psychologically abused, and then come back to me.
